BT,

The debate over "Science or God" is a different blog.

Lula, I don’t care to discuss homosexuality with you or any Christian who abjectly condemns them to a person … unheard and unseen. These arguments of yours are a disgrace to logic and common sense. I am willing to bet that you know little more than what you have seen on TV and in your Catholic hate mail.  I don't care what the RCC does or doesn't do or why anymore ... they are a nonentity to me ... meaningless. The debate over "Science or God" has long since been decided … you just like to list your arguments for practice I suppose. Heaven forbid but I thought we were discussing hate not gays. “Why am I a Hater?” not “Why we hate and condemn fags” … is all. Enjoy yourself if this bigotry is appealing to you.

Humm ... no 'science or god' then huh?

PS: the other article is “Science and God (One and the same?)” by the way.

Quote feature is not working. 

BT,

posts:

Lula, I don’t care to discuss homosexuality with you or any Christian who abjectly condemns them to a person … unheard and unseen.

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Fine. Don't then. 

But here's the distinction.  I have not ever condemned the person who calls him/herself "gay", but rather their sexual behavior, homosexuality, which is intrinsically disordered and against the natural law since the body parts don't fit.

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BT posts: 

Heaven forbid but I thought we were discussing hate not gays. “Why am I a Hater?” not “Why we hate and condemn fags” … is all. 

Your statement makes me wonder if you read Rightwinger's article. We are discussing both as well as a few others thrown in. Those people who criticize homosexuality are called "haters". 

Do you think calling people "fags" is a loving term? I don't but that's me. 

Then why do you advocate against them having certain rights and privileges that have absolutely nothing to do with sexual behavior? As if the sexual behavior of people you don't even know is any of your business anyhow. 

As far as the individual goes, and what is done in privacy, I have a "live and let live" attitude. But we are in a full blown sexual and cultural revolution and that's where I am focused. Since our founding, one side subscribes to the fact that Almighty God is the source of our rights (not the State) and are based on a moral code and natural law. The other side subscribes to the libertine, "anything goes" atheistic philosophy which shows increasing intolerance for what still remains Judeo/Christian and the natural order among these are the institutions of marriage and the family.  

As far as i know everything the homosexual movement wants changed whether in municipal, state or federal laws, policies, education has to do with imposing full societal affirmation of homosexuality as normal, acceptable, respectable and even good. 

The atheistic philosophy is not one of "anything goes". It is one that uses real life evidence to explain why certain choices are better than others that have in many cases severe consequences. Telling someone not to do something because they will burn in hell and then promising them the option of a confessional to avoid such hell after a choice is already made sounds like a rather ineffective way to solve societal problems.

They simply want the same legal rights and protections that others are afforded.

Unfortunately for people like you who don't understand the constitution the first amendment states:

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion"

So you may keep your Judeo/Christian traditions in your church but when the issue makes it to Supreme court the argument will not be made on religious grounds because that will not hold constitutional muster..

Here is a timely news article that goes to the heart of this discussion.

http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/santorum-rips-obama-admin-for-censoring-abstinence-as-artifact-of-a-bygone?utm_source=LifeSiteNews.com+Daily+Newsletter&utm_campaign=e53fcacf86-LifeSite

Last 2 paragraphs

He also took a moment to criticize those who were poised to label his position or statements “hateful” because he defended marriage, something he said doesn’t mesh with the values America promotes.

“Everybody’s trying to impose their values. ... Come into the public square make your case as to why same-sex marriage should be the law of the land. I have no prob with that at all. Make the argument,” he said. “But accept the fact that other people who disagree with you don’t hate people who disagree with them, they just happen to believe that marriage is a good that should be preserved.”

Did you not see that there is a word I used to describe the '"anything goes" atheistic philosophy'?

My point stands.

Interesting Smoothseas.  I hadn't thought of it until you framed it this way. However, oh yes, penance for one's sin (Confession) is indeed Christ's way of solving societal problems. He knew He wasn't going to be physically here on earth with us and so in His Infinite Mercy and Love, Our LOrd Jesus Christ came, redeemed us, set up His Church and gave her priests His own authority to forgive sins.

On the night of His Resurrection, Our Lord appeared to His Apostles in the Upper Room. "He breathed on them and he said to them: Receive ye the Holy Spirit. Whose sins ye shall forgive, they are forgiven them; whose sins ye shall retain, they are retained." St.John 20:22-23. There's plenty more too. 

We are talking about the sexual act of homosexuality. Any sexual act outside the lawful marriage covenant is a sin, an offense against God's law. Sins cause societal problems.

For the most part, when people commit sins against the virtue of chastity, they know from their conscience and in their heart, they done wrong. For those who acknowledge this and want to obtain forgiveness, forgiveness is offered and given. The healing begins and problems go away. One person at a time.

Societal problems are solved one person at a time.

Lula, what do you suggest the gay community do to appease your frail marriage vows / system? Most don’t use the Church today anyway … so you have all those marriages to contend with too. Am I myself not “wed” because I didn’t use the Church? You know if this is about marriage, you might be better served going after the divorce system which makes it so easy to split the marriages asunder. Your attack should be waged against the legal system, not the people trying to use it to gain some support through it. The world is changing and just because you choose to live your life with a two thousand year old philosophy … well you will just be left further and further behind until …? If you despise gays so much, then you will fail to recognize their unions anyway, so nothing will change for you or your God … but legal unions would provide comfort and support to one of the groups trying to destroy the RCC hahaha. When you can attack them for something more than their private personal habits (like some actual crime), maybe I will listen … but right now you are just practicing open Biblical bigotry, and that I won’t be party to. As far as I know, these people just want some civil relief, humm … the parts don’t fit properly you say, hehehe, you do live a sheltered life for sure. But then again, the Bible is replete with Intolerance, Bigotry, and Obsession, isn't it?

No the issue is the civil marriage contract. It has absolutely nothing to do with sex and absolutely nothing to do with religion. The issue does not concern religious vows it concerns the rights and protections that couple are allowed by the government.

If you think the issue is sex take it elsewhere because other peoples sex life is none of your business.

What I meant by that is Rightwinger's article and the discussion is mainly about homosexuality.

Knock, knock...there is a sexual revolution going on that's direct aim is changing people's view of homosexuality. The Homosexual movement activists are steadily working to impose changes in law, policies, education as well as the institution of marriage so that homosexuality is societaly accepted as normal, respectable, even good.

Homosexual "marriage" is a public manifestation of homosexuality.

Homosexuals already have the same legal rights and protections that others are afforded.

What they want is special rights based on their so called "sexual orientation" which is homosexuality. 

Knock knock....there have been revolutions going on for centuries to change peoples bigoted views.....Remember slavery and the civil War? Remember the  Civil rights movement? How about the women's suffrage and women's rights movements?

Over Santorum's cold body.

Yea, you got me there, hahaha. But he still has to get elected and I do not think his chances are all that good. I know I won't be voting for him anyway.